the fine line between kwaito and vernacular hiphop..........

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trusoul
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Thu Aug 04, 2005 12:22 pm

the fine line between kwaito and vernacular hiphop..........



forgive me but i simply have to ask

guys tell me why is it that people like j-stash can openly diss rappers like pitch black afro about how they cant even rhyme in english?

does the queens english determine your music genre?

what happens when a so called kwaito artist does a collabo with a so called hiphop artist, what genre does the song or even better- the album fall under?

why is it that you are called a snob/chiz boy/chiz gal/model c if your spitting is totally on the queens level?

people say kwaito has changed, is it me or has it changed inclining itself towards vernacular hiphop?

has freedom of speech been so defiled to a point where our right to it encroaches on other peoples rights to make a living?

is beef really neccessary people, cant we be entertained by people sending out subliminal messages of brotherly love and peace?

why do some rappers feel superior to kwaito artists when it it indeed kwaito artits who are topping more charts, and are being received by larger audiences?

hmmmmmmmmm :?: :?: :?: :?:

tell me something people, i battle with these thoughts everyday.

TeeZeR
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Wed Aug 10, 2005 5:10 pm

Good topic, i saw this on Monday but couldn't reply! Okay here's what i think, people who always has a lot to say (Hip-Hop artists) always find those with less verbals (Kwaito Artists) to be some fools or some sht like that! Kabelo is a Hip-Hop head, but he is a kwaito artist...his lyrics are more of hip-hop inspired! Kwaito has always been something from Kasi, it was meant to make you dance...at the same time, give the message! I love kwaito, always did!

I respect kwaito for what it is...in the past it had no much lyric content...but now it's facing another generation, it's being more lyricized. Every MC has something to write about...to get attention;

Skwatta > Media (Mostly)

Selwyn > Kwaito

Prokid > Reflects kasi life

ProVerb and ProKid...we all know how famous ProKid is, but still...there are a lot of people who doesn't know about ProVerb! Why? Memium lingo of Lyric content. Most people from kasi connect more with native written songs, or atleast local English written. I live in kasi, and sometimes I try to get someone to hear some ill punchline and you find that person goin..oh yo..haai ke yona! Sho! But facial expression would be depicting the opposite. So it's all about who you wanna reach! And doing that in the language you can best represent it in!

About J Stash...i think such cats are jus lookin for attention. I think Hip-Hop is all about you, expressing what you feel or reflecting what you see to others! English, Sotho, Zulu...well in any lingo, if it's Hip-Hop it's Hip-Hop!
because of the lack of truth...

brothers perceptions become pestilent

thinking by speaking good english they are intelligent
Fck J-Stash!
bashin
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Fri Aug 12, 2005 5:42 pm

I once saw a headline onda HYPE mag bout this J-ASS(Stash) guy havin beef with SK but i couldnt go into detail.Wassup with le outie, he seems 2 be beefin with every1.

somebody tell me.what gives kwaito the upperhand over aboMrepa when it comes to the sales?
TeeZeR
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Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:37 pm

[quote name="AddictiveSoul"]

Kwaito as a whole though, is just about making people get down. Yes there is a message, but alot of it is irrelevant. eg : "shiy' iscefe...siyodlimali (sp)" ? and "siya groova akekh'ugogo"....?

I'm Not putting your music down Tee, but.... *shrugz*

.....................

Hiphop probably aint really getting to the people too well as yet, coz although they do talk about relevant shyt like life ekasi or whateva - the way they're getting that message across to Mzansi cats is not effective. They're adopting the Americans' way of doing things... talking about "the hood".... I mean we wanna hear about our people's hustle to the top. SA style, not the way some Bronx brotha would do it! Yes Prokid is gettin' it right.. [/quote]

Jeah...kwaito was infact meant to make you dance...originally! But I think the criticisms lead it to a point of it to like..."have a message in it"! Remember that with most of our people...whenever you hear a track with someone bubbling long English in it...you jus go on to press "SKIP"! Meaning our people were not...in a nutshell...interested in vocab or messages(history) in songs! That's why you have 50 Cent and other mainstream cats having high sales for their "Baby I love you" OR "Suck my lollipop" rhymes...this is no DIFFERENT from shiy' iscefe!

Well...i dunno, different people are interested in different things, but there are some who are still ignorant! :wink:
bashin
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Mon Aug 15, 2005 3:25 pm

[quote name="TeeZeR"]
[quote name="AddictiveSoul"]

That's why you have 50 Cent and other mainstream cats having high sales for their "Baby I love you" OR "Suck my lollipop" rhymes...this is no DIFFERENT from shiy' iscefe!

100% correct Mfethu!!!
trusoul
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Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:01 pm

[quote name="AddictiveSoul"][Hiphop probably aint really getting to the people too well as yet, coz although they do talk about relevant shyt like life ekasi or whateva - the way they're getting that message across to Mzansi cats is not effective. They're adopting the Americans' way of doing things... talking about "the hood".... I mean we wanna hear about our people's hustle to the top. SA style, not the way some Bronx brotha would do it! Yes Prokid is gettin' it right.. yo gurl[/b][/i][/color][/quote]

personally, i second my nubian sister where she talks about how SA hiphop at the moment is still america orientated, that's why some people might not relate, also DARKIES OUT THERE JUST WANT TO SAKA AND NOT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT HOW DEEP A POET/RAPPER IS i feel people are slowly warming up to the idea, as for j-stash what he had in mind had the opposite effect, so all those who intend on riding others peoples waves here is a tip don't it's not impressing at all. english has always been a debate chizboy chizgal ifeel people must educate themselves and stop hating!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

thanks to all of you who have made an input it's really worth while to hear your views

much love!

trusoul

:D
0z
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Fri Oct 14, 2005 5:04 pm

in my opinion:

Kwaito has changed a lot, it used to be this dance/house beat with a single line of lyrics repeated over and over. Now you get get kwaito songs with a whole page of lyrics( with some exceptions ). Kwaito(presently) can safely be classified as the South African version of Hip Hop.

Similar cases: Reggae then and Reggae Now ( i'm not saying Reggae is like Kwaito but merely stating that Their evolution's heading to the same direction)

Both genres are now emulating Hip Hop.

And Jay Stash: That was his strategy to get noticed ( flyers don't do it for him )

Well, thats what I think

-Oz
TeeZeR
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Mon Oct 17, 2005 10:23 am

[quote name="0z"]Both genres are now emulating Hip Hop.

[/quote]

Indeed...but it's quite hard for a hip-hop artist to say kwaito is a South African version of hip-hop! I really feel what you're saying...hip-hop is all about life and all conscious issues, and back then kwaito artists didn't have a lot to say, instead...they summarized it all in one or two lines! But right now it's all changing! On the real note...I kwaito is reaching a state where it would be debatable to call it SA Hip Hop! But most lyrics written are still wack...commercial appeal! So it has another miles to travel, maybe this journey will be quickened by emerging artists! We all know that there are lot of artists who are hip-hop motivated but are doing kwaito! Eg. Zola* and Kabelo!
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